Read Voltimum's September Letter of the Month on Part P from a very frustrated JIB approved electrician.
Voltimum is proud to annouce a new feature to the website: The Letter of the Month. We received a lot of emails throughout the month of September from our users raising very important issues in the Electrical Industry and we have chosen the following one as our Letter of the Month and you will find below it a series of reactions following the publication of this letter:
Dear Sir or Madam,
I am writing to air my astonishment of the Part P Regs. As so many other approved electricans in the country, in theory I agree electrical installations need tighter monitoring. But how can this be done when superstores sell the equipment(materials) with VERY basic leaflets on installation for the untrained installer?
Also I have also been told that if I proceed with a planned house extension in the early part of next year, I would need to pay an NICEIC electrican to wire the extension to satisfy the new regulations. And this is a pathetic situation to me as I myself am a J.I.B. approved electrican working for a NICEIC firm with my C&G 2391 Test and Inspection Qualification. So I would appreciate any information that would make sense to me on how this will be of benefit to me.
If you have any views on this issue please do not hesitate to express them!
Please find below a series of responses received about this letter:
Response 1 from Ross B.
Further to the letter of the month, a case such as this typifies the confusion over the Part P Amendments and highlights either how this new legislation has not been thought out OR just adds another bureacratic level to our industry.
In this case the electrician has his 2391 and, I assume, carries out electrical inspection and testing for his NICEIC Approved Firm. Therefore, with the sanction of his company, he can carry out the works himself and have it certificated, by himself and his 'NICEIC Qualified Supervisor' with his companies test certificates as most NICEIC companies are now 'Accredited' under the Part P legislation.
What the Part P does is force competent and fully qualified installers to 'enrol' with any one of a number of 'Accreditation Bodies', hand over £500 and become 'Accredited' as 'Domestic Installers'.
More snouts in the trough!
I fail to understand why possession of an ECS card with the requirements of the EAS Scheme satisfied is not acceptable for 'Accreditation'. The only difference is that an 'Accredited Installer' will have his work inspected annually (with a further annual charge!) to retain this 'Accreditation'.
Regards
Response 2 from Brian K.
Dear Sir
I read with interest yet another whinge and moan about Part P.
I'm a one man band. I suffer from people like you who are not registered and have no intention of being a registered electrician.
May I suggest - If you do your job properly and you are competant and proud of what you do, you would go the extra mile, that is sit up and be counted like me. You too can register as a 'competant person' under Part P. You do not have to be self employed or own your own firm.
Your extension can be wired by you next year, however, as you will not be registered as a 'competant Person' you will have to apply to the local Building Control and pay to have your work inspected and to obtain a completion certificate.
Maybe! finally! a level playing field will be for all electrical contractors. If you are not prepared to be counted with the rest of us, maybe a good idea is to do something else where you can hide and not be accountable for what you do.
And yes I am registered with the NICEIC and yes I am a member of Quality Mark.
Quality Mark is now changing to Quality Scheme and will be an organisation for all trade bodies who represent genuine contractors who try to do their jobs properly.
Registration is the only way forward for the safety of householders.
The superstores can sell whatever they want, however, the responsibility under Part P will rest with whoever does the electrical installation and the person who orders the work to be done.
Times are changing and accountability is just round the corner.
Yours Faithfully
Response 3 from Gary Y.
I agree in part with writer of the letter of the month, but unfortunately it is not always the case that JIB Approved electricians with the C&G 2391 and with years of experience are carrying out work as per BS 7671.
Many thanks
Response 4
I agree with the writers comments regarading super stores. I recently called in at B & Q and above the shelves where they sell electrical goods are mock boards with circuits installed showing Joe Bloggs how to run ring mains etc. This new Part P is just driving work to the unqualified and weekend workers. There is no way that anyone can police this correctly. Building control in our area is a joke
Electrical contractors should be issued with seals which can be used to seal fuse boards & meters, if these seals are broken then the owner of the property would be liable for prosecution having allowed an unqualified person to work on the installation?
Regards
Response 5 from Ray M.
Having been in the trade for 50yrs. ( as a time served electrician before JIB were ever heard of ) and running a small business nothing surprises me now.
There must be a group of people who do nothing else but think of ways to hinder workers,(people who actually produce something).
Most of the electrical installation work I carry out is in factories or production plant I.E.machinery, production plant, panel work etc.
I have found in the past that the NICEIC was mainly only interested in what I call house bashing work.
The last time I took one of their representatives on site to a machine I had installed, which took a starting load of over 2000amps, the only reaction I got was
have you not wired any houses we could look at,so as I say I am not surprised.
Regards.
Response 6 from Jason D.
Being an approved JIB electrician myself I fully agree with the comments made by letter of the month. It has taken me a long time a lot of expense and hard work to gain my qualifications as an approved electrician. I feel that it is a tax on the industry. Small firms and individual electrician's will fade away to make way for the "super electricians" to print money. The average diy person will attempt to do the work themselves to cut costs creating an increase in dangerous wiring. I am dismayed and disillusioned with the way the electrical industry is going with the introduction of part p, this has resulted in me re-thinking my career with the possibility of totally changing my job as an electrician to something totally different.
I feel that the professional approved electricians have been placed in the same category as the DIY people in the new part p proposal, to me this makes a VERY BIG mockery of all my years of hard training to become a professional trades person.
A angry JIB Approved Electrician with C&G 2360 1&2 electrical Installation, C&G 2391 inspection & Testing and Certification, C&G 2380 16th edition wiring regs, AM1, AM 2 and an equivalent NVQ 3.
Response 7 from Steve C.
Dear Sir,
Many electrical contractors and electricians have BS 7671, BS2391 and are JIB gaded/registered but we still have to join
an approved scheme to self certify our works. I am in the process of applying for mine. I think it would be far better
if only skilled or qualified electricians had to produce their ticket to buy materials. (The sheds would put a block to that).
They say you have to notify Building Control and self certify your work. I know a few (builders) doing loft conversions
having their work seen by building control. The quality of workmanship is sub standard yet I certify my work on
completion but I haven't got big flashy vans and cars. Where are we going wrong? Perhaps by joining a scheme it will improve
- Let's all hope. Then we can have flashy vans and cars and rip people off. The only thing is I can sleep at night through being
tired from doing the
job correctly and I have a conscious, will Part P put it all right? I don't think so. Do you?
Response 8 from Michael A.
In reply to your September letter of the month I would like to say;
As I understand you would not need to employ a NICEIC approved electrician to do the work but just to inspect and test the work carried out by a qualified electrician (such as yourself), or you could employ a building inspector to carry out the inspection, which would take a long time as there will be a lot of other unapproved electricians re-wiring their house or someone else’s
I do agree with you when you say the DIY companies are still selling electrical materials as the usually phone in the experts as soon as the get stuck and cause us more problems and create themselves more expense, either that or they just do it anyway and it will cause us problems a few years later when someone else lives there.
However something did need to be done, as corgi did for gas installation to domestic properties, but they should of given everyone more time and until the government stop the superstores selling their electrical materials, these problems will always occur and PART P will not work.
I have my own electrical business and always regarded myself as a competent electrician and I’m also a JIB electrician, but as from 1st January I’ll no longer be classed as a competent electrician unless I enrol in the NICEIC, which I have applied, but what will happen to all the up and coming electricians who want to go out on their own? They will be stuck in a catch 22 situation where they can’t enrol because they can’t prove their competence, but they can’t prove their competence because they haven’t the experience to enrol.
More thought was needed.
Response 9 from Alan D.
I do not think you are interpreting the Part P regulations correctly, as I understand the regs you can elect to wire the extension yourself, however you will need to get clearance from building control and you will need the work certificating by a contractor who is registered. Yes there will be a cost implication but it is not as drastic as you make out. In your case you should be able to get your employer to certificate the work!
Good Luck
Response 10 from Nigel E.
Dear Sirs,
I agree with all the points your 'letter of the month' contributor has mentioned.
Until the superstores (sheds as known) , electrical wholsealers, or any outlet in fact are stopped from selling electrical cables and wiring accessories to the public, the the Part 'P' Regs has a significant bad leak in its intention to monitor the electrical installations, mainly carried out by NON electricaly qualified D.I.Y. enthusiasts, or the 'man next door'.
Any one from the public sector who wishes to purchase electrical cables and wiring accessories from electrical wholsalers should have to produce some sort of proof of qualification obtained in the electrical industry, eg C & G 2391 or knowledge of BS7671etc. We are a N.I.C.E.I.C. approved contractor and i think until the points mentioned are put into practice, we are not playing the game on a level playing field. We have been asked on numerous occasions to give a completion certificate for works done by people not connected or registered in the electrical industry, to which we have refused.
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